Date   : Wed, 20 Jul 2005 19:38:55 +0000
From   : Jules Richardson <julesrichardsonuk@...>
Subject: Re: Can you identify this?

On Wed, 2005-07-20 at 19:21 +0100, Philip Pemberton wrote:
> In message <1121843889847.kris@...>
>           "Kris Adcock" <kris@...> wrote:
> 
> > Hmm ... would it have run in its own right, or would a normal Beeb have been
> > used to control it?
> 
> Depends what was loaded into its ROM. They were used for industrial control
> IIRC - get the code working on a Beeb, then blast it into a ROM and stick it
> in the Eurobeeb.

I mailed Kris seperately the other day, but the machine looks *very*
System-like in board design. I was puzzled by the 6509 CPU as AFAIK
there never was a 6509 CPU board for the System line by Acorn or others
(just two versions of 6502 and the 6809) - but the fact that it's *not*
a System machine explains a lot :-)

> I'd certainly be interested in seeing the docs. If you want rid of the
> machine, I'd be happy to offer it a home :)

Ditto on the docs front. As far as the museum's concerned we can't
really go spending money on items though much as it'd be nice to have
one of these critters!

> > If Richard Gellman (if it was him) follows through with his threat to design
> > a more modern Beeb, doing it with EuroCards connected on a common "backbone"
> > would be an interesting way of doing it! Want an Econet card? No problem -
> > just build the extra card! Don't need cassette circuit? No bother - just
> > don't build it!

That's the System way :) Actually, a lot of the design concepts (if not
half the circuitry) for the System line ended up in the BBC B (which is
pretty logical really), and of course the Atom's expansion bus is the
same as the System (indeed the Atom disk pack uses a System FDC
controller board inside). Wouldn't surprise me if this Eurobeeb is
exactly the same bus too.

System boards (going from memory):

6502 CPU board (version A)
6502 CPU board (version B)
6809 CPU board
Keypad / display board (as used in System 1)
40-column VDU interface (with Teletext)
80-column VDU interface
Laboratory interface
32KB DRAM board
DRAM / ROM board
PROM programmer board
Versatile interface board
Analogue interface board
Econet board
FDC board

I've also got a third-party memory board (Control Universal I believe).
I don't think the speech circuitry from the Beeb ever made it onto a
System card, but otherwise there's enough there was enough available to
basically build the equivalent of a BBC B into a case with a Eurocard
backplane. Keyboards used the Atom shell, but with a different key
layout (or maybe Atoms used the System keyboard shell... I'm not sure
when the Atom was designed versus the System 2 and later machines which
used said keyboard)

Actually, it's kind of strange that the EuroBeeb existed when the System
machines were designed for that job; I'm surprised there was any kind of
market for them.

It's a shame nobody really collects or plays with System era stuff (at
least I don't know of anyone). There seem to be a few System 1 machines
surviving out there, but not much else; they seem to be shunned by Acorn
collectors for some reason.

> I've got a 6502-based Eurocard computer here - DIY job. There's a CPU+RAM+ROM
> card, a speech synthesizer, a UART and an 8-port backplane.

Wow - any chance of any photos? Thinking about it, wasn't the Maplin
weather station system from way back when a 6502-based rack job? I'd
love to find one of those some day. 

> > Hee hee. That's what I like to hear! I'll clean it up, and see what other
> > related stuff I have with it.
> 
> I want it! Me first! Me first! :)

Hey, I emailed Kris within a few minutes of the post hitting the
list... ;) Heh heh!

cheers

Jules